Asian Expat Series: Interview With Biyang Wang, LCSW

What This Series is About

This series explores the diverse array of experiences among Asian American/Canadian expats and nomads. The demographic of people I’m specifically referring to are members of the Asian diaspora who grew up in North America because they or their parents or previous generations were immigrants. After growing up in North America, these Asian folks later live elsewhere and become “expatriates.” Some may be long-term travelers and nomads who move from one country to another. Others may be expats for some time in one location and then return to their home country.

The narratives and images we have of expats are overwhelmingly white. When I look at FeedSpot’s list of the top 70 expat influencers, there are very few who identify as BIPOC. It’s hard to say how many BIPOC or Asian expats there actually are. There aren’t a lot of reliable statistics about American expats. From my research, the most trustworthy estimate is from The Association of Americans Resident Overseas (AARO), whose updated figure was 5.4 million as of 2023. They don’t break this figure down further to look at more specific demographics so it’s not clear how many of these expats identify as Asian American. In my experience of traveling and being an expat, I’ve learned that expats are not a monolith. They are in fact a quite diverse, multi-racial, multi-ethnic group.

Check out the other posts in this series, including Reverse Immigration and My Reckoning With Asianness in Japan and my Introduction to the Series.

Interview

I love meeting Asian expats and it’s even more extraordinary to meet Asian American expats who are also therapists. Biyang Wang is a Licensed Clinical Social Worker and we met through Location Independent Therapists, a network of mental health professionals around the world who are either mobile themselves and/or work with globally mobile clients. In this interview, I loved hearing about Biyang’s perspective and experiences. One of my takeaways from her is that it can be tough to subvert expectations by becoming a full-time traveler. As Biyang put it, this way of living is off the beaten path for many Asian Americans who may feel pressured by their family or community to “settle down.” I also appreciated her re-frame of doing something different with her life as a source of pride rather than a reason to feel less of a sense of belonging. Biyang’s comment hit home especially because the other day, I listened to an interview with the Australian palliative nurse Bronnie Ware, who wrote the book Regrets of the Dying. She said the most common regret was “I wish I’d had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me.” I thought about all the times in my life I made the decisions that were expected of me, without stepping back and asking myself what I really wanted and valued. I think Biyang works on living a life that’s true to her and that’s not always easy or pleasant. But according to the dying, it’s truly worthwhile.

Below is our lightly edited interview about Biynag’s experience of being an Asian American expat for the last three years. To learn more about Biyang or to work with her, you can visit her website.

Where are you now? Are you living there or traveling through? 

Right now I'm in Auckland, Zealand. I will be here for 2 months before heading to Australia.

Where were you born and where did you grow up? How is your current location different from where you grew up? 

I was born in TIanjin, China. I immigrated with my parents to the U.S. when I was 9 years old. It's interesting to be asked where I "grew up," because while my most formative years were spent in the U.S., those early childhood years also had a big influence on me. 

Going to elementary school in China, school was the primary focus. I attended from 8 AM to late afternoon, after which I went home, only to do more homework. There wasn't any time for extracurricular activities, aside from my weekly accordion lessons on Saturdays. 

There was even less time for making friends outside of class. So when I arrived in the U.S., growing hobbies, playing with friends, and simple playtime felt foreign. I think that my directness, adventurous spirit, creativity, and my approach to life are very much American. 

I’ve only been in NZ for a month so I really can’t really make conclusions yet about similarities and differences.

What is it like to present as an Asian person where you are now? Are there any positive or negative experiences specifically due to being read as Asian?

I was surprised to find that Auckland has a big Asian American population, particularly Chinese and Indians. Since I travel every 1-2 months, it's rare that I am in an English-speaking country. So to come from Mexico, to New Zealand where English is the most widely-used language, and Chinese seems almost a second language (it's on the signs at the airport and many restaurants), feels like a warm blend of my American and Chinese roots. 

It's nice to feel that I can blend in more easily here. Sometimes it's nice to talk down the street and not feel noticed. 

In other countries, I have had experiences of feeling curious stares as I walk down the street. Since I present as Asian, many people aren't aware that I am from the U.S., and can speak both English and Mandarin fluently. I understand that it's natural to want to group strangers that we meet into a particular identity as a way to relate and connect. But it also brings up some assumptions.

When I was in Vietnam (Pre-COVID) I remember being in a Taxi once and the driver asking me about my background. When I mentioned China, he brought up politics, and expressed some negative sentiments towards part of Vietnam's history with China. While this is understandable, at the moment his frustration made me a bit uncomfortable.

That is a negative experience that I remember.

But most of the time, people are very interested that I grew up with 2 cultures and can speak both languages. In terms of native speakers. it’s estimated that there are 1.3 billion Chinese speakers, roughly 900 million of whom speak Mandarin. For English, there are roughly 380 million native speakers with almost a billion people who speak it as a second language.

(https://www.babbel.com/en/magazine/the-10-most-spoken-languages-in-the-world)

As such I find that most people are rather impressed.

In general, I think that the majority of people are very respectful and curious. However, even when people demonstrate hostility and lack of knowledge,  as long as they aren't threatening to me and are open to discussion, I can appreciate that the way to combat racism and bias is by having these difficult conversations and learning from each other.

Sometimes people assume an Asian person doesn’t speak English. Is this something you’ve experienced and if so, what do you think about that? 

When traveling, English seems to be the second language everywhere. Whether it's Albania, Morocco, Jordan, Lithuania, or any other country, when someone realizes you don't speak the local language, their reaction is to try English next. In that sense, I feel that English is how people connect with each other. 

With that said, when I tell people I'm from the U.S., I'm often met with surprised looks. This is so new to me because in the U.S., we're so used to the diversity that if someone is American, they're American. I think it was after 2 years of traveling that I had one light bulb moment of realizing that much of the world only see my outside as Asian and puts me in that box, and being American isn't so second-nature. 

As with anything else, if someone approaches me with curiosity, respect, and openness, I don't take offense to this since we all generalize one way or another. Asking questions and having conversations is a way we can challenge these assumptions.

How often do you encounter other Asian expats/nomads? 

Being in New Zealand is the first time I've met many Asian expats. However, given that they tend to have immigrated from Asian countries, they have a different experience from me as an Asian American.

While most other countries also have Asian expats, it seems that the Asian digital nomad community is comparatively smaller.

I don't want to make generalizations but from my personal experience and from working with AAPI patients, I've noted that especially for immigrants and children of immigrants, to travel the world as a way of self-exploration, instead of going down a traditional path of working and raising a family can lead to judgement from both families and the community. Although remote work has become more popular in the recent years, the idea of "settling down" still remains. I don't think that's necessarily exclusive to Asian cultures, since the stereotypical "marriage, kids, house, big savings..." idea as a pursuit of adulthood is widespread.

Being an Asian American woman means being part of an even smaller community.

Instead of feeling a lack of belonging, I mostly feel a sense of pride to be able to follow my dreams and carve out my own path in life.

The US has seen a sharp increase in anti-Asian hate crimes since 2020. What do you think about this? How does this situation in the US compare to your experiences abroad? Have you ever either experienced racial epithets/slurs or feared for your safety as an Asian person abroad? 

I feel sad and frustrated to see people of a specific identity attacked and dehumanized by other groups. It's something I can comprehend, but hard to understand in the sense of how people can harm someone else based on their external appearance, without any knowledge of their character and their individuality. 

I started traveling again in the summer of 2021, so it was right when countries were opening up, but COVID tests were still required for entry. At that time, I did notice that on the streets, people tend to be colder to me, or there's a general distance. 

I think that especially for countries that really depend on tourism as a way of living, it was no doubt extremely difficult, and it makes sense they may harbor resentment to China. Being Asian is very visible, and when people haven't been exposed to diverse cultures, they may become judgmental and biased.

It’s interesting because if people treat me differently, my mind doesn’t go directly to “oh it’s because I’m Asian” though that’s part of my appearance, and more that it’s because I’m different from them and the unfamiliarity feels scary to them, and their aggression stems from a place of fear.

There is a recent trend of “reverse immigration” among those in the Asian diaspora who are going back to Asia. There are two big groups of people who are part of this trend. One is older adults who want to retire in their motherland. The other is young to middle aged adults who are drawn to Asia for professional opportunities, interested in connecting with their heritage, and hoping to find less racism and more acceptance in Asia. What do you think about this? Is this something you yourself have considered? Spending substantial time in the place you or your parents or grandparents (etc) immigrated from? 

This isn't something I've considered, but I'll answer this based on what comes to mind first.

I grew up with my grandparents on my mother's side. When they were both still alive, going back "home" (to China) meant visiting them, along with other close relatives. Once both of them had passed, it felt weird to think about what "going home" now means. 

I think I'd love to travel around China, since it's a BIG country with so much beauty, history, and culture. However, my personality, values, beliefs, etc. are not completely aligned with the Chinese mentality. I also tend to stand out in the way that I dress, speak, and mannerisms. During one of my trips back to China, I remember having a candid conversation with a driver, who admitted that I definitely seem westernized with my less conservative clothing choices, my directness in voicing my needs and opinions, and how freely I express my ideas.

With all this said, I've gotten used to appearing "different" when I travel, so perhaps having a similar experience the next time I'm in China won't feel as uncomfortable as when I was younger.

What are some ways that you stay in touch with your cultural values, customs, and/or practices while abroad? And what advice do you have for new Asian expats/nomads for maintaining a positive Asian identity? 

Certainly wishing my family Happy Chinese New Year, eating mooncakes, and sometimes eating noodles or dumplings help remind me of home. Unfortunately, I am not the most vigilant in remembering these dates, but my parents and relatives always remind me and send me wishes on these Holidays.

I don't do anything special to maintain traditions, but I've always been very aware and proud of my dual identity as an Asian American, and it's something I carry with me internally wherever I go. 

In terms of advice, I'd say do what is comfortable and genuine to you. Practicing these values and customs hopefully feels joyful and special. If you feel pressured or think that you SHOULD do these things, then that takes away from their meaning and purpose.

This isn’t an experience exclusive to Asians but one of the things that I think is interesting when I tell people about nomading is they say “Oh wow I wish I could do that.” I become very aware of my privilege in that moment and at the same time, wonder if it’s really true that they can’t. What’s it like for you if people express admiration or envy of your lifestyle? 

Nowadays I've gotten better at not trying to minimize my experiences and accept their admiration, while also recognizing my privilege. I think I was in their places once and can relate to their sentiment. I can empathize with having a dream and yet feeling like "this will never happen for me." 

One thing that does frustrate me is when people assume that my life is glorious, without problems or struggles. When I try to tell them the reality of things, such as problems I’ve encountered, they seem to change the conversation or not follow up. I feel unseen in these moments because I’ve had to overcome a lot of self doubt, fear, and a variety of barriers to get to where I am. Life is always changing, and challenges will be a part of it. There’s no destination where everything is perfect and resolved.

I think sometimes people like to imagine this picture perfect life, and tell themselves “oh I can never achieve that,” because to pursue their dreams, they also have to face the fear of the unknown, and that’s the hard work. It’s easier to imagine without taking action.

I know this from working with patients, and have gone through periods of this in my life as well. It’s something that still comes up for me.

If someone is more curious to talk deeper, I talk more about how I started on this journey and got to where I am. I want people to know that even if they won't live exactly the way I do, if they have a dream, it's possible to make even the smallest pieces come true. 

Ultimately I want my life to inspire others and give them hope. For me, that means being genuine and open with all aspects.

More broadly, what advice would you give about wellness to individuals who aspire to be expats/nomads? Anything you have found useful or helpful or grounding? 

I like to say that I'm a rather boring person, meaning I have the exact same daily/weekly routine no matter where I am. I work out daily and get at least 8-9 hours of sleep.

Since I travel while working remotely, I maintain a consistent schedule so I always feel calm and in control of my life. I've been doing this for almost 3 years, and aside from weeks when I'm fully traveling, having a routine helps me feel grounded and safe within myself. 

Another is to feel connected and be a part of something. Whether that means keeping in touch with friends and family, meeting new people while traveling, finding peace in nature, or engaging in learning and new experiences.

How long do you think you might be living abroad? 

Ah, good question!

I don’t know yet.  I'm still on the road, but I definitely want to stay longer wherever I am. Well, since I was moving around every month, nowadays 2 or 3 months is progress!

I’ll have to follow my intuition and be honest with myself. I want to make sure that this is something I want to do and not something that I’m doing because it’s now my “normal” and I’m afraid of change. My goals and dreams continue to evolve, so I want my life to support that, not keep me from pursuing what is difficult. 

As long as this lifestyle continues to give me joy and fulfillment, and I feel aligned with principles and values, I’ll keep doing what feels right for me.